Why Creative Burnout is a Good Thing and Storytelling is a Superpower
In the dynamic world of entrepreneurship, harnessing the power of storytelling can be a game-changer. Molly Baker, Founder and CEO of Indie Consulting, had the privilege of speaking with Chris Chavez, Founder of Citius Mag as he discusses his journey in building an impressive business through storytelling. Tune in as we explore the benefits of creative burnout, the importance of following your interests, and the rewarding experience of betting on yourself.
Molly Baker (MB): So how's your day? How are you feeling?
Chris Chavez (CC): It's like that time of year where there's just nonstop track and field action happening week in, week out. I think it's important to strike a good balance between work and shutting things off. That's the hardest part, especially being that I have a much smaller team.
I'm not NBC or ESPN or anything like that. So hanging in there for sure.
MB: With all that going on, what are you thinking about? How do you prepare professionally for the next couple of months?
CC: This is an important year for anyone who covers sports, especially Olympic sports. With track and field, it finds its limelight every 4 years.
And so for us it is a big opportunity to establish ourselves. Really buckle down and reaffirm that we're the go to place for all things track and field news, commentary, analysis, and results. With the Paris Olympics coming up, it's a big opportunity for the athletes, but then at the same time, a huge opportunity for a startup.
MB: Brag about yourself. What are you really good at?
CC: I'm really good at finding an audience and informing & educating them on all things track and field related. Especially empowering the athlete voice and sharing athlete stories. Also getting people super excited about a sport like track and field.
It's not the NFL or Major League Baseball, but it is a very big sport at the participation level in high school. There is an opportunity to build a fan base. That's what I really love, tapping into audiences to tell these stories that are oftentimes overlooked. I work in a space where we get the limelight every 4 years, but then there's important work to be done in the years between, and so I really dig my heels in those years.
MB: So you're a storyteller?
CC: Yes. Which it's interesting because I find myself overusing that word.
I come from a journalism background, but I think I've definitely shed a little bit of that part of my identity in this switch I had in my career 3 years ago. It's hard because I still have that journalistic instinct.
The way I approach storytelling and content creation is definitely more from a fan's perspective. So it's okay to be excited, pick favorites, and spew your thoughts and takes. That's a big part of the way I see the average sports media consumer changing. You gotta get with the times. Newspapers and magazines- they're having their struggles. Sports is something that's never going to go away, and so you have to always be ready to pivot and change strategic approaches.
MB: Talk a little bit about the content marketing landscape today. Where do you source inspiration from? How do you see it evolving?
CC: It's interesting because you have to stay on your toes. If you're in the content space, most people right now are on TikTok. Then you read the news and there's all this talk about the app going away or shutting down. That's concerning. A lot of people make all or some of their money off of that one specific platform. I am of the belief you can never anchor down on one platform.
Strategically with the work that I do, I look to not necessarily produce 20 pieces of new content across different channels. I like to think of it as 3 or 4 quality things a day and redistributing them across varieties of channels. If you do an interview with someone and it's a podcast, repurpose and redistribute that in many ways. You have to think of it in a marketing way. How am I gonna market this thing across a variety of different channels to get the most eyeballs on it?
You have to cast a much wider net. I'm definitely of the belief that you can't just rely on one place and you can't be lazy about it. You learn through practice, and so you have to invest the time and take cues from a variety of different people.
When I first started, I looked for inspiration to shape my website. Being a fan of Bill Simmons and The Ringer. I also saw how Barstool Sports effectively built personalities within their ecosystem, attracting audiences to specific influencers for sports news and takes. That was what was lacking in the sport that I was focusing on, so it was very simple. Let's just try and take cues from a variety of different playbooks and bring it to a space that doesn't have that.
MB: So you talk a lot about the work that needs to go into putting pieces of content across multiple platforms. How have you operationalized that?
CC: I think it's one of the hardest parts of starting something from the ground floor, you have to be versatile. There might be people in my position who don't know how to make an Instagram graphic or the best social practices. I'm lucky in the sense that I'm growing up at a time where I didn't need to go to college and take classes on how to live tweet an event or anything like that.
On the outside looking in, you see an Instagram account that has 100,000 followers and a bunch of content being pumped out, but it's a small team. It's myself, one or two other guys who are full time, and then we've got a bunch of contractors that are on deals for a year or three. They have been reliable people who get the approach that we take to covering sports and the news, where we have a different voice. We're not just giving people stale facts. Sometimes it's got a little bit more excitement, a couple of emojis thrown in.
The hardest part is delegating a lot of those responsibilities. I'm at a point where I don't produce my own podcast, but I was a control freak with that for the longest time. I surrender the keys to Instagram and Twitter, when there's a big event because I've gotta be the person going out and getting interviews.
When I remember what the early days of doing this were like, I don't understand how I would have been able to take the approach that we do to covering events now without a team. The team is really important. Talent is really hard too, you can find a lot of people who have the credentials but they have to understand our tone & voice, personality, and mesh with that really well.
I get a lot of resumes and emails from people and it's so nice but, I have to turn away a lot of people too. We're looking for people who are ready to have fun in the way that we do it. It's hard because I'm definitely one of those people who likes to create opportunities for as many people as I can. When I started doing this, I was 19 years old and I was very fortunate that there was an opportunity at a place that was still kinda growing at the time, and I fit right in.
MB: You all create such a large volume of content. How do you prevent creative fatigue?
CC: That's hard because there are no breaks in this season; there's always something happening with outdoor, indoor, cross country, high school, college, and professional events. It's tough.
There's marathons and all this kind of stuff. So, there are no breaks, but it's important to take a step back sometimes. Having a team is important too if you can't expect one person to watch 50 track meets a year. Even I get sick of that. As much as our whole mantra is that we love track and field, there could be a lot of it sometimes, a lot of people running in circles.
The burnout is tough. Professionally, I experienced it after covering my first Olympics in 2016. Citius Mag started because I was going through this Olympic comedown. The media gets it too, not just the athletes. You spend so much time focusing on one particular event, and then it happens and the next one is 4 years away. I had so much creative output between 2012 and 2016 where that was all I was focused on. My dream was to make it to the Olympics. Then to realize no one else is gonna care until 2020.
I experienced that burnout. But then I created Citius Mag to have that outlet afterwards. Trying new things and seeing where it goes. Maybe you're sick and tired of writing for several years. Try your hand at a podcast and see if that is easier.
That's how I fell into podcasting. I realized I didn't have to do an interview with someone for a whole hour, and then worry about transcribing every single word. On top of that, crafting a whole 2,000 word story around the whole thing.The moment you stop hitting record, the whole conversation in its entirety could be out for someone to consume within an hour or so.
MB: Part of the reason why we created Name Drop- there were lots of reasons. I started Indie because I am a marketer. I've gotten to the place with the business where I'm not on client work anymore, so I'm not creating. I wanna be making something and when we decided to do the podcast, I was totally re-energized again.
CC: The toughest part is sticking with it. I'm focused on creating a product that all track and field fans will enjoy or can rely on. I take pride in the fact that I'm doing 10 interviews a season of a show and all of them are gonna be badass.
MB: What relationship has been most impactful on you professionally?
CC: This is a great question. I spent six and a half years at Sports Illustrated (SI) and my time there was valuable because I got to work with some amazing editors both on the website and the magazine. I learned how to quarterback a newsroom. My job was to be the breaking news editor of a team of over 10 writers, so it was really cool because every day was interesting.I didn't know what the big story was going to be so there was that level of excitement going into work every single day. I was in one of the writer's shoes when I started as a fellow coming out of college for a whole year. I'd turn in some writing and it'd get ripped up, and have to take another pass at it. So through that, I always was one one of those people who was like, just tear me apart. That's how you learn from your mistakes the best.
To be surrounded by some of the best in the industry was great because I learned so much in that process and I still have a lot of those skills that I use to manage a team of 10 writers. It's really fast paced and that gave me really good practice for what I do now. I really do give that up to my editors at SI, in particular, Ryan Hunt, the co-editor in chief of SI.
When I started Citius Mag, I had to downplay it in my first ever conversation about it when I got called into an office. I didn't ask for permission at the very beginning to start this. I don't know if I was violating my contract but [Ryan] gave me the green light. It worked out, I never broke the rules and I found that great balance. It was cool that in December 2021 when I ultimately had to have the conversation with him that I was choosing to leave SI to go full time [at Citius] he kind of expected that this day would come.
I'm really thankful for that environment at SI, which was able to help me sharpen and develop a lot of skills that I use to this day.
MB: Tell us who you are and about Citius.
CC: I'm Chris Chavez. I'm the founder of Citius Mag, a digital media entity covering all things track and field, running the Olympics, and I host a weekly podcast. My whole approach is storytelling around some of the best athletes in the world, and scale it up and welcome new fans. Our mission at the end of the day is to make it easier to follow track and field because it's one that is fairly fractured and run-in some very old school ways. I'm here to bring a new school approach. It kinda disrupts things, but that's a good thing.
MB: What does an average day-in-the-life look like?
CC: It's interesting because when I left SI, my first day was January 3, 2022, and that was very quiet. Now we're talking in May 2024 and there's so much to follow along, especially in the ramp up to the Olympics.
I've learned, in addition to being on the content creator side of things where I love interviewing people and jumping on breaking news, there's a business side of things too that I have to manage now. It was definitely a learning period, and I am still in that learning period of being a full on business owner. My day consists of scheduling out podcast interviews, checking in with the producer on my team, or someone who's handling social. We do a whole staff meeting in the month leading up to things to establish who's going where, what's our plan, who are we working with. It's a lot of calls and computer time. My chiropractor hates me.
A lot of calls not just interviewing the creative side of things but also locking down money to go cover events. Our business model is a lot of these brands who want us to cover their events and go be essentially the hype people for the sport and their particular athletes. Managing a whole calendar of things.
It's fun because in retrospect- I think of 2022 starting off full time, I was asking for pennies. And the brands are quick to say, yes. We'll hire you for that much money. Now, we start to have a feel for what we're worth and advocating for that. The conversations can sometimes go a little bit more back and forth.
I have more responsibilities, I can't just choose to go on this trip because it's more fun or these athletes are gonna be there. I have to create those opportunities and delegate those responsibilities now. There's planning on that side of things so that I don't necessarily have to be at every single thing. But part of me sometimes does have FOMO.
Then other times, I do have to be at things to handle the relationships with these brands that are paying us some good money to be there and put out fires.
MB: How has your experience as a professional changed since you started Citius?
CC: In the grand scheme of things, that first year we kinda got lucky in a sense. The first couple times that we did a post game show from a track meet, it really wasn't all that planned out. The natural chemistry that the athletes had with us, our laid back approach to things, and our overall knowledge of the sport came in handy.
You’d tune into one of these events and when it's over, you get an episode of Shark Tank or whatever it might be. Whereas with other sports, that's not the case. There's always that carryover when you get your audience feeling super excited about what they just saw. We fill that gap. By accident, that became something that was a really strong product for us. It just all meshes so well.
If you would have asked me on January 1, 2022 what is it we do well, I would have said it was podcasts and newsletters. Now we created another channel that makes money as well. That helped us get better clarity on where we live in the whole space.
Again, the mission is to make it easy to follow. We're okay telling you this is how you watch it because more eyeballs on the sport is a good thing for us. Other people view it as this product they have to protect. We definitely wanna approach it as being okay with telling people where things are, even if some of these places see us as competitors. Where we really thrive is the pre and the post of an event, making people care about athletes. When it's all said and done, you come to us because we're excited and talking about it.
It's a long way of saying I learned that we're gonna do our thing in the places where there's more opportunity to be the storytellers in the whole space. That was my biggest learning and helped shape a lot of our day to day.
MB: What do you see as the biggest opportunity for Citius in the next couple of years?
CC: A lot of the key stakeholders in sport just continue to point to LA 2028. That is when the Olympics come back to the United States. There's a big ramp up to that and their whole goal is to make track a top five sport in America. That'd be great for business for us but, I think that you can't set the goalpost in the finish line.
It's the years in between where you gotta buckle down, reassess, and try new things to find those audiences and get people excited. That's where we come in and there's a big opportunity, especially if there's gonna be more people coming off of the Paris Olympics who are gonna be interested in track. There's a Netflix series that's gonna be coming out and who knows what the effects of that are gonna be. We've seen it successfully translated in other sports.
It's been year after year steady growth for us across all channels. We've never spent a dollar to buy a follower or a subscriber, it's all organic. When you look at the comment section of one of our posts, there's tons of engagement. That's the part that's really fulfilling, we've created this community of people. Other like minded people who also just happen to be really passionate about the sport that isn't super popular.
MB: At 21, did you ever think you would be where you are now?
CC: 9 years ago? No.
At that point, I was at SI just getting started and I saw that as I could have been there forever. I call [SI] the Titanic of sports magazines. There had been moments when the Titanic looks like it's about to sink- there's massive layoffs, round after round. I survived multiple rounds of layoffs, and that was great. When I was 21, I just saw myself as a writer and wanted to get to the level of writing some kick ass magazine stories.
It really did take going to the Olympics, experiencing that burnout right afterwards, and testing new things for me to find that creative outlet and output. I didn't think that this little blog on the side was gonna become a digital media company.
MB: You also put yourself out there and I think that's really scary. There's risk associated with that in the beginning. How did you overcome that?
CC: It gets a little bit better when you start to put yourself out there. And I noticed that when I was at SI, I'd write these stories or break some news on Twitter and people would consume it, and that's great. But it's very easy to scroll past a name when you're reading a story.
Pivoting to the approach that we take with Citius, we definitely put me out there more. I'm on my podcast where people can hear what I sound like and watch me in videos- more forward facing in front of a camera. I think that in a way you start to have to be okay with that. You're never gonna please every single person out there.
You're gonna have tons of critics online and you have to kinda get comfortable with it over time. It's an adjustment period, but as you build that platform it does get nerve wracking at times. I keep my Instagram a little bit more professional because I don't need runners who follow me to know what's going on in my personal life, that's a challenge.
Sometimes you wish you could take a step back and be more anonymous. It comes with the cost of growing something and being public facing. I have learned to not check the running message boards and shut that out. Over time, the positivity outweighs everything else.
Trendy or Tragic
Snapchat having a renaissance with the youth.
CC: I don't have it. It is a big potential asset for someone else to acquire. I think that's what it's probably shiny for. So I would say trending, because it's something for someone else to buy.
CC: I woke up and saw clips about this. It looked amazing.
I haven't watched it in its entirety. I was glued to a bunch of the clips. Netflix- that was gold for them.
It goes to an earlier talking point where what you see on a traditional TV broadcast is alright. Post game interviews where everyone's still polished. But this Netflix roast; from the clips that I've seen, was R rated material.
When they talk about football locker room talk, this is it on Netflix. Trending.
Equinox- $40,000/Year Membership
CC: I'd love to meet the people who were the guinea pigs to test this whole thing out, because now that sounds like too much. The price is ridiculous. This one's tragic.
It doesn't take that much to be healthy. You don't even need a gym membership sometimes. If we learned anything from the pandemic, you can just get out the door and run. I could spend $40,000 better to keep myself healthy in different ways.
Check out Chris Chavez on Instagram and Linkedin, @citiusmag on Instagram and citiusmag.com. Also be sure to tune into the Citius Mag Podcast, available on all podcast players.
As for us, follow @namedrop.pod on Instagram & LinkedIn and @molbakes on Instagram for all future episodes and insights.
